Nutella and Nemo,

I'd love to ask... how many weeks do you think ought to be a reasonable amount of time before trying to apply some effort. I'm in the nebulous 9 week category where TSM might not have taken hold but we might be fixed in habit. I truly want to do the right thing but I'm finding it hard. Obviously you can't answer what is best for me -- but based on your own experiences I would be curious... thx BTDT

Hi BTDT, I wish I could answer that. But being a binger, I normally have many AF days. Also kind of difficult to keep a daily log. I know the numbers are definately down for me. AL free is easy for me IF nothing TRIGGERS it! Then I have 1, 2, & it's out of control. Very bad hangovers since Nal, too. I think maybe one of the other members that are daily drinkers could help answer that for you.
ALWAYS, JANE

I personally think 1-2 months should be a threshold for "If you're not happy with your results, try some effort." As we've discussed elsewhere, NAL may be giving you control but you might not even realize it without at least trying to slow down or have AF days. At first, I found it easier to have AF days than stop after 4-5, but later, both came easily.

What's the point of TSM? To get to a point where we can comfortably drink like normal people. To drink more slowly than we used to, to drink fewer units. This may be a controversial statement, but let me just throw this out there: Don't expect the pills to make all the decisions for you. Some people experience a big drop in consumption and cravings without having to think about it. But from what I see on the forum, those are the minority of the cured. The majority are those who applied a bit of effort, and were then amazed to discover how much control NAL had given them, how easy it was to slow down, cut back, and take days off.

That's the funny thing about "effort"-- it's what normal people tell alcoholics to do. "Just slow down. Just don't drink so much." They don't understand how impossible it is. But NAL makes it possible! NAL, when it works, gives you the control that normal people have.

Echoing Nemo, re: NAL makes control possible. Yes it does.

Personally, I started planning almost immediately once I recognized that I can. The moment I got the power of control, I started exercising it. Even now, 54 weeks after, I occasionally catch myself with a thought like "****, with all the bad news this week and especially today, how wonderful it would be to just get plastered again and be able to forget about it". But then I just tell myself "no" and limit consumption to around 14 units a week. This is probably akin to something non-alcoholics do on a regular basis.

Yeah, me too actually. I felt the effect of NAL the first time I took it, and I was testing the limits of the control it gave me from Day 1.

I say 1-2 months because there may indeed be many paths and goals within TSM, and these will be personal. You will probably figure out the best path for yourself. But I recommend trying some effort to those people whose paths don't seem to be working out for them.

Nutella and Nemo,

Thanks for your responses and direction. I will do everything in my power to moderate this week. Something has to give or I may need to quit TSM . I planned to stop all daytime drinking this week and two days in I did it again. Grrr. But, I must be exercising some control because I stopped early yesterday because I needed to not be too hungover today.

My goals for the rest of the week - take the weekend off so I don't spoil Halloween, no daytime drinking, no more then 5 drinks per day. I'll let you know how it goes. Unfortunately, I haven't had success before but I desperately want to stick with TSM.

Thanks again, BTDT

Sinclair says to "set your own goals," and I applaud your goals, but perhaps start with just one of the ones you mention? Rome wasn't built in a day. Also, 5 drinks a day max is perhaps an overly ambitious goal for someone on the verge of quitting TSM and averaging 8-12 a day. Start with small improvement/goals and build on that.

Goals don't have to be about counting units per se. Some goals could be, "I won't drink so much that I puke," "I won't drink so much that I pass out," and "I won't drink so much that I embarrass myself." Also, like I said, AF days are sometimes easier than having just X units a day. Sometimes it's easier to have zero than "just 5" or "just 8".

Good luck in whatever path you take.

I concur with what nemo said. That's pretty much what I have done. My first goal was "no daytime drinking". Next was "no more than a bottle a day". Then followed "some AF days every week". First week I planned AF day it turned into white knuckling, so I did not persist. But next week went AF came about easily.

In ideal world my goal would be "no drinking alone", ever. This would automatically restrict my consumption to around 5 units a week. Sadly, I am still far from this goal. I can enforce it if I wanted to but I keep obsessing over some wine (but a unit or two per evening is almost always enough).

Nemo & Nutella,

Thanks again. My number one goal is "no daytime drinking". This is the one that gets me in the most trouble and suffering the worst hangovers. Taking AF days hasn't been too hard and I completely agree it is easier to take an AF day then manage my drinking once I start!! If I drink only at night, Ive been stopping on my own at 8-10 drinks, sometimes less if I'm tired. This all by itself has been a positive change. Lately, I have been hitting a "saturation point" where I really don't care for more. For now, five is probably too aggressive. This is definitely the goal that would be hardest to hit so I'm not going to worry if I don't. Maybe just paying attention and asking myself... Do I really want more might help me cut back. I so appreciate your advice and support on this!!! Btdt

I am just kind of thinking out loud here after reading some of the responses to this thread:

What if NAL for some people is not a magic pill that will automatically solve their alcohol problems without any effort at all -- other than taking the pill each and every time they drink (compliance)?

What if, instead, NAL is a very effective tool, that when used TSM way, can help the problem drinker to gain more control over his or her drinking?

Even if NAL is only an very effective tool for some people, it can be a difference maker that allows a motivated person to win the battle by curbing the desire to drink more and more alcohol after the first few drinks. In other words, taking NAL the TSM way can make the problem drinker more like a normal person that can exercise more control over their drinking.